Mythic Battles: Ragnarok Discussion

Yea, and I predict Ragnarok may be more successful than Pantheon, both because of the theme as because all the balance issues that will turn up after the release of Pantheon will be streamlined in Ragnarok.

Don't want to rise the debate from the dead but more dynamic poses for female miniatures this time, please.

Pseudonyme wrote:

Don't want to rise the debate from the dead but more dynamic poses for female miniatures this time, please.

+1

What female miniatures are concerned there is plenty of room for improvement!

Carandini wrote:

Fenrir being my favorite mythological being in any mythos, i do hope will be the most imposing figure in the game. A gnarly wolf draped in chains that is bigger than Typhon and maybe has the bones of Baldr's missing hand stuck between his back teeth!

Um, yea,... ALL of that.... Rawr!

Fenrir (pronounced “FEN-reer;” Old Norse Fenrir, “He Who Dwells in the Marshes”[1]) is the most infamous of the many wolves in Norse mythology. His importance for the pre-Christian Scandinavians is demonstrated by his being depicted on numerous surviving runestones, not to mention his ubiquity in Old Norse literary sources.

He’s the son of the god Loki and the giantess Angrboða, which makes him the brother of the serpent Jormungand and the underworld goddess Hel.

As is recounted more fully in the tale The Binding of Fenrir, the Aesir gods raised Fenrir themselves in order to keep him under their control and prevent him from wreaking havoc throughout the Nine Worlds. He grew at an astonishingly fast pace, however, and eventually the troubled gods decided to chain him up. Their first two attempts were unsuccessful; while the cunning gods convinced Fenrir that it was only a game, a test of his strength, he broke through the fetters easily. For their third attempt, the gods had the dwarves forge the strongest chain ever built, which nevertheless gave the appearance of being very light and even soft to the touch. When the gods presented Fenrir with this third fetter, he became suspicious, and he refused to be bound with it unless one of the gods would stick his or her hand in his mouth as a pledge of good faith. Only Tyr was brave enough to do this, knowing that it would mean the loss of his hand. And, sure enough, when Fenrir found himself unable to break free of his bonds, he ripped Tyr’s hand from its arm. The chain was then tied to a boulder and a sword was placed in Fenrir’s jaws to hold them open. As he howled wildly and ceaselessly, a foamy river called “Expectation” (Old Norse Ván) flowed from his drooling mouth.[2]

As the river’s ominous name implies, this was not the end of Fenrir. At Ragnarok, he broke free and ran throughout the world with his lower jaw against the ground and his upper jaw in the sky, devouring everything in his path.[3] He even killed the god Odin before finally being put to death by one of Odin’s avenging sons.

Fenrir and Other Wolves in Norse Mythology

There’s good reason to think that many of the other wolves mentioned in Old Norse literature are actually Fenrir going under different names. One Old Norse poem states that he swallows the sun during Ragnarok,[4] a feat which is elsewhere reserved for another wolf named Sköll (“Mockery”). Another old Norse poem repeatedly mentions a wolf named Garmr who breaks free from chains at Ragnarok; this is almost certainly Fenrir.[5] In another source, we find the wolf who consumes the moon called by the name of “Moon-garmr” (Mánagarmr).[6] Thus, the moon-eating wolf, who is elsewhere called Háti (“Hatred”) would seem to be another extension of Fenrir. It appears that it was ultimately Fenrir who, in addition to killing Odin and destroying much of the world, ate the sun and the moon during Ragnarok.

Fenrir (or Fenris) is a gigantic and terrible monster in the shape of a wolf. He is the eldest child of Loki and the giantess Angrboda. The gods learned of a prophecy which stated that the wolf and his family would one day be responsible for the destruction of the world. They caught the wolf and locked him in a cage. Only the god of war, Tyr, dared to feed and take care of the wolf.
When he was still a pup they had nothing to fear, but when the gods saw one day how he had grown, they decided to render him harmless. However, none of the gods had enough courage to face the gigantic wolf. Instead, they tried to trick him. They said the wolf was weak and could never break free when he was chained. Fenrir accepted the challenge and let the gods chain him. Unfortunately, he was so immensely strong that he managed to break the strongest fetters as if they were cobwebs.

After that, the gods saw only one alternative left: a magic chain. They ordered the dwarves to make something so strong that it could hold the wolf. The result was a soft, thin ribbon: Gleipnir. It was incredibly strong, despite what its size and appearance might suggest. The ribbon was fashioned of six strange elements: the footstep of a cat; the roots of a mountain; a woman's beard; the breath of fishes; the sinews of a bear; and a bird's spittle.

The gods tried to trick the wolf again, only this time Fenrir was less eager to show his strength. He saw how thin the chain was, and said that was no pride in breaking such a weak chain. Eventually, though, he agreed, thinking that otherwise his strength and courage would be doubted. Suspecting treachery however, he in turn asked the gods for a token of good will: one of them had to put a hand between his jaws. The gods were not overly eager to do this, knowing what they could expect. Finally, only Tyr agreed, and the gods chained the wolf with Gleipnir. No matter how hard Fenrir struggled, he could not break free from this thin ribbon. In revenge, he bit off Tyr's hand.

Being very pleased with themselves, the gods carried Fenrir off and chained him to a rock (called Gioll) a mile down into the earth. They put a sword between his jaws to prevent him from biting. On the day of Ragnarok, Fenrir will break his chains and join the giants in their battle against the gods. He will seek out Odin and devour him. Vidar, Odin's son, will avenge his father by killing the wolf.

That's what happens when I make posts when i'm tired. Of course I meant Tyr not Baldr

Leonidas wrote:

Orword: mechanics won't change. You might see some new victory conditions, game modes... and a different style and feeling overall. But it will be compatible.

Then you can definetely count me in!

I'm looking forward to it.  Norse mythology is great!  

Can we look forward to getting maps for all of the Nine Realms?

One of the best author in the world has just released a retelling of Norse mythology!!! Got a couple books to finish but can't wait to read this new Neil Gailan book!!!

https://twitter.com/neilhimself/status/827321301341609984

Hmm... My have to look into this book.

Also, that is a great map!

Good that I looked through the forum first, I was hoping to see something about the Nordic pantheon! Even before the kickstarter for Pantheon ended, I hoped for a Germanic/Norse themed game next, and that update certainly was one of my most favourite (being a pagan myself).

Can't wait what you guys will have up your sleeves for us next!
Tyr (obviously), Thor, Siegfried, Fafnir, the Einherjer... it will be awesome.

Pseudonyme wrote:

Don't want to rise the debate from the dead but more dynamic poses for female miniatures this time, please.

Unfortunately, the choice of the Norse mythologie will probably mean very few naked skin - no more boob-gate ?
(or maybe some with a Paolo Parente model)

Hellikin wrote:

Can we look forward to getting maps for all of the Nine Realms?

1. Asgard, the home of the Æsir ruled by the god Odin
2. Álfheimr/Ljósálfheimr, the home of the Ljósálfar
3. Niðavellir/Svartálfaheimr, the home of the Dwarves who are also synonymous with the Dökkálfar and Svartálfar
4. Midgard (Earth), the home of humans
5. Jötunheimr/Útgarðr, the home of the Jötnar (Giants)
6. Vanaheimr, the home of the Vanir
7. Niflheim, a world of ice and snow
8. Muspelheim, a world of fire and lava and home of the Jötunn Surtr
9. Hel(heimr), the home of the dishonorable dead sometimes synonymous with (Located within) Niflheim and ruled by the goddess Hel

Did you pin the different boards that will be available ?

Telgar wrote:

Pseudonyme wrote:

Don't want to rise the debate from the dead but more dynamic poses for female miniatures this time, please.

Unfortunately, the choice of the Norse mythologie will probably mean very few naked skin - no more boob-gate ?
(or maybe some with a Paolo Parente model)

Oh no... last time it almost made me cancel my pledge.

I will have to be strong, because I backed World of smog and will back Zombicide Green horde and will be in a lot of domestic trouble when my wife will see our savings transformed in plastic soldiers!

I would LOVE to be able to have my MBP and MBR go to ...wait for it... WAR !!!!! Battle for the heavens!!! The gods have been removed from their pantheon and are forced to roam the earth and gather followers. Thier followers devotion helps a god ascend back to the heavens where they dwell. Along the way they find other gods are roaming the earth gathering followers also. The devotion(ompahalis) from the followers help a god ascend back to the heavens. this way all the MB future games can be stand alone or work together for a greater more dynamic battle! Fenris versus Cerberus..FIGHT!!! Who wouldn't want to see this fight. The list goes on and on and on...like watch them old Godzilla movies. Titanic monsters clash across the world for the sake of their pantheon. LOL i could on for hours with this. Maybe I should start a new thread and get everyone stirred up with the thought. drop me a line to let me know what you all think.

Pseudonyme wrote:

One of the best author in the world has just released a retelling of Norse mythology!!! Got a couple books to finish but can't wait to read this new Neil Gailan book!!!

https://twitter.com/neilhimself/status/827321301341609984

Bought yesterday and started to read it. He's such a good writer (at least for a french chap )

Now I "dream" of a non-miniature-stretch-goal for Meetic Battles Ragnagnarock being a Battle report writen by Neil Gaiman himself. That would be sooooooo cool.

Pro tip for the producers: do you know that you can live happily with only one kidney?

I too would love to see better representation for woman in the MBR-game. I absolutely love MBP but I think better representation would make the game even better and more accesible. Since we are making suggestions, I will try to make a couple of suggestions for kick ass female models. Everyone can feel free to chip in and help, the more suggestions, the better!

Goddesses
Freya (Godess of almost everything, she is kind of lika a mix of Athena, Afrodite and some mage-god? She is an equal warrior-god to Odin, and gets half of the fallen warriors when Odin gets the other half, she is a fertility godess and the shaman who teaches Odin the power of the runes. Seriously so badass and the best of the gods by far! ) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freyja

Hel (Goddess of death, basicly Hades) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hel_(being)

Ran (Goddess of the sea, sort of Poseidon) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A1n

Skade (Godess of skeeing (a big deal in the north!) and hunting -kind of like Artemis) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ska%C3%B0i

Gerd (Giant-goddess, bride of Frey and famous for here beutiful/muscular arms) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ger%C3%B0r

Idunn (Goddess, keeper of the apples of eternal youth that all the gods rely on) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I%C3%B0unn

Frigg (Goddess, queen of the Aesir and keeper of secrets. Knows a lot about the future) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frigg




Rans nine daugthers (monsters) They are all named after different sea phenomenons. In particular Blóðughadda, The Bloody-Hair (a reference to red sea foam). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R%C3%A1n

The Norns (monsters) the three guardians of the weave of fate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Norns



Different named valkyries (heros), for example Trudi (Thrud), Thors daughter and therefore by default kick ass and strong. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9Er%C3%BA%C3%B0r Brynhilde, from the Völsunga saga. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brynhildr There are also several others. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valkyrie

Sigrid the Haughty (hero) her name in swedish is similar to "mighty ruler" but could of course be disrespectful. She is known as a vengeful intrigue maker. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sigrid_the_Haughty

Lagertha (hero) Shield maiden, wife of Ragnar lodbrok. Kickass warrior https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagertha

Aslaug (hero) wife of Ragnar as well. More of a cunning and smart character. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aslaug

Blenda (hero) A queen who rallied the women of midden sweden when the men were of fighting and bet the danish https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blenda

Hervor (hero) a shieldmaiden who battled her fathers ghost for the famous magic/cursed sword Tyrfing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hervor

Þorgerðr Hölgabrúðr and Irpa (heros) two minor goddesses, described as sisters, that appear at the Battle of Hjörungavágr to assist the fleet of Haakon Sigurdsson against the Jomvikings. The two goddesses produce harsh thunderstorms, ferocious squalls, and shoot arrows from their fingertips, each arrow described as killing a man, resulting in the defeat of the Jomvikings. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%9Eorger%C3%B0r_H%C3%B6lgabr%C3%BA%C3%B0r_and_Irpa

Skuld (Hero, not to be confused with the Norn of the same name) a half-elven princess who raised an army of criminals and monsters to take over the throne of her half-brother Hrolfr Kraki, using necromancy to resurrect any fallen soldiers before she personally saw to Kraki's end. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skuld_(princess)

Völva (hero) A name for a schaman and seer, but this could be the most famous one, who foretells the end of the world in völuspa, the story of the beginning and end of the world. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%B6lusp%C3%A1 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V%C3%B6lva




The Kvens (Troops) A people were the women were the warriors. Probably mythological and seemingly like the amazons. Probably seel-hunters and kick ass! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_of_the_name_Kven

Lesser valkyries (troops)

Ordinary female shield maiden (troop) (maybe one-two of five in a unit or something?) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shield-maiden

Dis (troop) female spirits, kind of like mist-people. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/D%C3%ADs




http://edition.cnn.com/2017/09/14/health/female-viking-warrior-grave/index.html
https://theendofgrey.deviantart.com/art/Norse-Goddess-Calendar-Cover-645388848
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_women_warriors_in_folklore

Faderberg wrote:

I too would love to see better representation for woman in the MBR-game.

Gender equity is nearly reached for Goddesses in MB:P (I count 7 among 16 gods)
Not so much among Titans and troops.
A fair number of heros (I would say 1/4 ?).
And among monster, it is tricky to say... (is this snake male, female, both or neither ?) but a number have 1/2 female body

I do really LOVE MBP, so no need to convince me about that.

that said, I count:

Gods 6/9/0 (female/male/hard to tell) so not really equal but a good count! 40%
Titans 1/4/0 20%
Heroes 8/31/0 ~25%
Monsters 8/7/22 ~25% as well (the count beeing a bit hard here of course. Not counting the obvously male lion as a man but an animal, but counting the minotaur as male here. Each to their own)
troops 4/10/7 ~25% again. Hard to count here as well.

The gods are almost there I guess, but most other are not. It is of course hard to find as many acounts of strong female potential models in this patriarchy, hence why I put together this list as an inspiration. No hate or critique, just inspiration!

Used this link for the counting https://photos.google.com/share/AF1QipOwKlwW7uG6bPU0SX1hMKCz-fDCtHH7QkofLjATAsu-cjNdQWmhsfZyjwi1bno_GQ?key=Vzh5Y1V4MHFtcE05NVlDSWtXVVVvNjhrdm03ckpR not counting cards twice like sirens or paolos minis)

.I personally hope for a rage or berserk ability, or rather that after the few damage took the unit may lose some defense but in return increased attack stats.
That way you would want some of your units to take a bit of damage to be at their best combat ability...but to much damage is weakening them again.

I also hope that they find a way to emphasize the trading and exploring nature of the Vikings. Maybe even including a map in America just for the fun of it...

I would also like to see not just gods as "leaders" for your troops, but rather have at least one leader of each of the realms (a bit like the Titans who aren't gods in MBP). So that you can do thematic battles between the different realms.

I would also like to see a few "elite troops" who cost two points and maybe cost two AoW cards to recall? Also, at least one for each of the realms (For example Jotunheim could have just elite troops consisting out of two giants. each giant has two lives and they are stronger than normal troops by 1 or 2 in attack and defense.)